(00:00:00) Open the phone lines for your questions to Bernie in just a moment. But before we do that, I want to ask you about the big item of Labor related news this week. And that of course was the settlement of the Hormel strike at Austin, which I guess you'd have to rank as one of the most contentious labor disputes in recent Minnesota History. Anyway, the company hired replacement workers the international Union throughout the local. It was certainly a very messy Affair and I guess I'd like to know what your observations are on that now that theoretically anyway, it is about settled Bob. I appreciate you're starting out with an easy question this morning and I will share several limited observations with you with regard to the Hormel situation. But first, I'd like to extend to your listeners to the working people in Minnesota greetings and best wishes for a safe and peaceful Labor Day holiday on behalf of the Minnesota AFL-CIO and are affiliated organizations. You observed that the Hormel? Strike was a very contentious labor dispute labor-management dispute as I like to call them because it takes two parties to engage in that kind of difficulty the Minnesota AFL-CIO as a Federation of labor unions of course was not directly involved in any contract negotiations involving Hormel or the United Food and Commercial Workers Local P9. We provided financial assistance through the regional office are affiliated organizations did likewise and provided whatever assistance and guidance that we could when it was requested by the international Union are rules and regulations that govern State Central bodies require that we have to get a request from the international Union the contract settlement that's been negotiated the tentative settlement, of course must be presented to the rank-and-file members for a rat. Vacation vote the news indicates that that's going to be coming up going to be coming up this week sometime this next week. So we'll see what happens but there seems to be kind of a collective sigh of relief in the community. If you read between the lines of the comments that are being made at least in most quarters there seems to be a desire to put that dispute behind behind us and get on with the business of working and living in Minnesota. What do you think is going to happen to the P9 workers who stayed out? Are they going to be pretty much just stuck while you do you foresee any chance of them getting their jobs back at some point? Well, we don't know precisely at what what the contract provides for. I understand that that's not going to be released until the rank-and-file members have a chance to receive that information, but it's our sense that there's a strong desire to return those. Old workers to their jobs in the Hormel company after all her male has a great deal of investment in those workers training and so on many years of service obviously, they're not all going in there at one time. I suspect as job openings occur as as demand might increase plant capacity is expanded and so on I suspect that you're going to see some and hopefully all of those workers return to their jobs in that plant. The Hormel strike was a was a fairly contentious one, but it seems to be following a pattern that has developed over the past several years where unions have had to make contract sessions so called givebacks in order to keep jobs to keep plants operating not just in the meat packing industry, but we've seen it in automobiles and steel practically every major manufacturing industry in the country. So, I wonder if that kind of situation is going to lead to some fairly fundamental changes in the way unions are going to be operating in the future. I don't know. You know, what what kind of fundamental changes are going to be occurring at this point. I think it's realigning the the way that unions are dealing with with employers and it's affecting the labor-management relationship the industrial relations policy in this country. There's many other factors, of course that have contributed to to the phenomenon of concessions and contract givebacks and so on. I was interested to read this morning that the trade deficit that was reported was 18 billion dollars for I believe the month of July annualized. I think that's something in excess of 200 billion dollars. The fact of the matter is that the United States has lost a significant share of its industrial base. A lot of jobs have gone overseas the phenomenon of unemployment underemployment workers who have simply quit looking for work skill caused a Great deal of difficulty anxiety and frustration and anger in this country and it's my sense that the labor movement the men and women who are organized in the labor movement are going to come together perhaps in a manner quite different than what we've seen in the past in terms of the way. They organize their unions. It may very well lead to much greater involvement in solidarity amongst trade unions in the United States indeed perhaps around the world in terms of trying to deal with these multinational corporations that are taking away workers jobs are attempting to return wages to where they were 20 30 40 years ago and seem to be bent on destroying free trade unions in the United States Bernie bombers in the Studio's today. He secretary treasurer of the Minnesota AFL-CIO and if you have a question for him on this Labor Day holiday, you're certainly welcome to give us a call to to 76 thousand is the number of Minneapolis st. Paul 227. Six thousand and in other parts of Minnesota 1-800-662-2386. So here's your opportunity in states in the surrounding states. You can call us directly at area code 6 12 and our Twin Cities number is 2276 thousand. I wonder if we're talking a little bit about some of the some of the concessions and the trade deficit and so on organized labor is often a supporter of legislation that would restrict Imports and I wonder if you could explain why that is when most economists at least argue that restricted trade will simply lead to retaliation on the part of foreign competitors leading perhaps to a situation as serious as that in the late 20s early 30s, which of course was the Great Depression. Well, let me say initially Bob that I'm not a trade expert by any stretch of the imagination, but do have a fair degree of interest and And do a lot of reading regarding this subject and you know, the notion of free trade the policy that the federal government and particularly this Administration seems to embrace I think is a myth for the most part. The labor movement has said, you know, what we need is fair trade with with our trading partners this notion that somehow Or Another We're going to kick off a trade War if we protect the employment opportunities the jobs the manufacturing industrial base that we have here, you know, it's continuing to erode every day at this very minute. We're losing jobs to because of the trade imbalance are referred to the 18 billion dollars that was reported just today and many other countries take Japan. For example, they have all kinds of tariffs and and procedures and and things that the United States has to go through to try and export. Thanks to Japan many other countries. They're looking out for their own self-interest. They're protecting what they do the things that they manufacture and their Workforce while the United States clings to this myth of free trade and it's just hurting us immensely. It's been suggested by many experts that we've lost upwards of 4 million jobs in the last five or six years because of our trade policies and so on and I think that somebody the Congress whoever it is has to sit down and take a hard. Look at this. There's many trade bills pending in the Congress and we need some kind of protection for American jobs and communicate to our trading partners that you know, if we're going to continue we're going to have to have fair trade in addition to free trade. We got a couple of three listeners on the line with questions for you burning. Let's get them on the air and gas see what's on their minds. Hello. Your first go ahead, please. (00:09:02) Oh, hi. Hi one of the tools which are management has used to keep labor in life. Has been the threat to close plants where they're working and there have been during the last few years some instances around the country where labor groups have apparently bought out management after they announced that they were going to close a plant and attempted to operate the plants themselves. And I wonder if you could say what the track record has been whether that is a successful long-term strategy for labor to get some control over its working conditions and then a lesser form of control would be negotiating to put labor Representatives on the boards of directors of corporations that exists to a small extent and I wonder if you could explain what the track records of those two efforts have been as a in in respect to its benefits for labor. (00:10:00) You're correct in your observation that employers have implemented plant closings almost at the Of a hat one of the things that's happened. Of course in this day and age is the ability of employers to move capital is very Mobile in today's society and in our world with the Advent of satellites and and jet aircraft. You can move a company almost Around the World overnight and reopen it the next day labor is not that mobile you've got to work force their roots are in a community in a society and the attraction of cut-rate Labor workers who are forced to work for a few cents an hour in foreign countries is very attractive to the captains of industry in the world and they will move like I said almost at the drop of a hat the the strategy of that some unions have employed in this is very limited. So we don't really have a track record as such and it's being carefully monitored and watched in terms of workers buying out companies. There's been a steel plant out east in Virginia. I believe it was where workers and their Union bought a company. There's been a few other limited cases where that's occurred. It's still being watched It's Not Without difficulties. Of course, those companies are having financial difficulties and and they have to be watched very carefully representation on Boards of directors. I think is going to be an increasing phenomenon a growing number of Union seemed to be saying to the employers that you know, we want something to say about the management of this company and more than a couple of experts have observed that a significant share of our problem in the United States with regard to our industrial policy is the quality of our management the the focus on short-term economic goals not looking past the quarterly profit and loss statements and not adopting some long-term strategies has really hurt American industrial capacity. So that's part of the equation how all this is And to develop in the in the years ahead however is difficult to predict but it'll be watched very closely by the labor movement, you know, if there are any Minnesota labor people on the boards of Minnesota companies, and if so, what are they saying about their experiences? I'm not aware of any personally Bob where local unions that have localized contracts in Minnesota have negotiated representation on the board of directors of the company. I'm not aware of that most of the cases that we're looking at like the UAW, for example, they negotiated a seat on the board of directors for the Chrysler Corporation the most obvious and I think the most well-known one. Yeah. All right, let's move on to another listener with the question. Hello Bernie bombers listening. (00:12:46) Hi. I'm calling about situation my husband belongs to a union and they do not what they make the guys work overtime. They change the time on their time cards so that they're actually not they're actually paying them the hourly wage like They worked 44 hours instead of 40 the change it on their time cards for 42 hours and pay two hours overtime. So it balances out to the 44 hours in straight pay or 42 hours and straight pay and so they get around paying overtime now, it's a field where there's more workers than there is jobs. And so everyone's really scared to say anything or do anything and I was wondering if you have any comments or suggestions. (00:13:42) Fear on the part of workers is not an uncommon phenomenon in our society fear is regularly used to keep workers in the members of the workforce in line. And it's something that we have to constantly confront whenever we organize or whenever local unions are attempting to organize workers with regard to the specific issue that you raised about the workers your husband in particular the Minnesota Department of Labor and Industry is responsible for administering and enforcing the wage and hour laws in Minnesota. There are laws on the books in this state that the deal with the alteration of of workers times records and so on and I would recommend that you call the Department of Labor and Industry the wage and hour Division and the seek assistance from those people. Bernie brahmers in the Studio's today secretary treasurer of the Minnesota AFL-CIO and if you have a question, we have some open lines in the Twin Cities 2276 thousand 2276 thousand elsewhere. 1-800-662-2386 number is good anywhere within the state of Minnesota. Go ahead please your next (00:14:53) respecting our international trade deficit and the export by our big corporations of jobs to other countries. I wonder if you could comment on the idea of counter. exchange that is making the exchange of good. the policy of international trade (00:15:35) hmm. Not sure I quite follow the concept there. Is it are you saying that the that there should be sort of a barter system of goods traded between countries as opposed to exchange of currency or just what that's right? Okay. All right, Bernie, what do you think about that? Well again Bob and let me say for the question or The Listener that I'm not an expert on on trade policy, and I'm not sure that the concept that you that you espoused is a valid one or not. I'm sure however that everything should be examined. Every concept should be given a fair hearing because we cannot continue on the the trend that we're on where we're continuing to run up record trade deficits every month. That's just not going to serve the best interests of this country. So maybe you have something valid there and maybe it'll be looked at let me follow up. For a second on your earlier answer to the to the trade question. If somebody were to agree on the Japanese are not particularly generous in their Imports, but if the United States were to throw up barriers against steel and Automobiles and textiles and so on more than it has what would prevent the Japanese in our other trading partners from erecting even higher barriers and then we erect higher barriers. Yes. The situation is bad now but a trade War would be a lot worse wouldn't it? Well, I think that's a possibility and I think you have to be careful of that the historians tell us that that's what occurred I guess when the smoot-hawley Act was passed was Federal legislation with regard to with regard to trade a number of years ago. But the fact of the matter is that many of our trading partners today have trade barriers in place tariffs and and all kinds of mechanisms that they use in order to control the flow of imports into their respective countries. The United States on the other hand is a country where we have Goods flowing in here almost in an unrestricted manner. Although we do have some things that that are in place, you know, if if these other countries if the United States tries to protect and to reduce our trade deficit and they say, well you can't do that because we're going to retaliate and then I think there's got to be some kind of meeting with the heads of these countries and there's got to be some understanding reached that we just cannot continue. One of the things that that astounds me about this trade situation, you know at the same time that we have this erosion of the industrial base in the United States the loss of the four million jobs plus or minus that I referred to earlier good paying jobs, by the way in the manufacturing sector, I'm wondering who these people think they're going to sell these products to eventually in our society. Who's going to be buying these things? Because they're going to be priced out of the reach of the large number of American consumers. We're just not going to be able to afford these products anymore. So something has to be done. I think there's a growing awareness in Congress that this is the case also move on to some more listeners with questions for Bernie Bremer today. Hello, you're on with him. (00:18:51) First of all, I am a union member second. I would not be at all happy paying more for a car shoes and so forth because of restrictions. Also, I am an employee of a large company that halt imports from our from overseas at the point where the product enters our country. So our company would lose that Revenue. What is your response to this side of the Dilemma? (00:19:15) My response regarding that comment is to give you an example and I would suggest that you visit a local clothing store and find a shirt that's made in the United States manufactured by a domestic manufacture. Hopefully made by men and women organized in The Amalgamated clothing and textile Workers Union of America and then lay it side by side with with the shirt that's manufactured in Taiwan or the Philippines or someplace like that that comparison shopping has been done and what we found out is that those shirts cost the American Consumer the same price, even though there is a differential in the wages that are paid to the workers that that made those shirts a huge wage differential so somebody's making an awful lot of money on the particularly the clothing industry on those Imports that are coming into the United States shoes. This is another area where the domestic shoe industry has almost been destroyed in the United States. The clothing industry has been severely hurt. There's something that doesn't add up in this entire trade dispute and American consumers. I would suggest had better educate themselves in order to determine that if we do have some protections and some trade protections for American workers that it is an automatically going to result in price increases for American consumers. That's what we've been told and I don't accept that as a fact. Here's another listener who's been waiting and we'll put you on now with Bernie bomber. Go ahead. (00:20:52) What do you think is the role of the Minnesota unions to be in aiding entrepreneurs particularly new entrepreneurs in building employment in Minnesota. (00:21:07) Thank you for that question. I think it's an excellent one and I want to tell your listeners Bob that the labor movement recognizes that we have to have good employers to provide work for trade unionists for men and women in this state and we've supported Economic Development in Minnesota for a long time as an example as secretary treasurer of the Minnesota AFL-CIO I sit on the Minnesota Department of energy and economic developments board and serve there as a representative of the labor community in assisting entrepreneurs small businesses in Minnesota that have difficulty accessing Capital markets can't compete in those markets with the large multinational corporations. And that's just one example many other representatives of the labor movement unions are assisting in their communities. They support Economic Development and so on we've supported Venture Capital programs and will continue to do that. I wished we'd get that kind of support out of Private Industry with regard to organizing in and representing workers as a reciprocal kind of a thing, but we don't get that. Sometimes the charges made by some from time to time that Soda has lost its Competitive Edge in relation particularly to the bordering states and points a figure at the finger at the High Cost of unemployment compensation workers compensation things of that nature. What is your feeling about that? Well, we're certainly not unaware of those charges and and the complaints that have been made the so called the business climate argument in Minnesota. It's a phenomenon that's been going on now for a number of years and we dispute that, you know, there's an old saying about the proof of the pudding being in the eating or something to that effect. And if Minnesota is such a bad state to do business in and to start a business and industry, then it seems to me that we wouldn't have the successful industries that We have here the 3M is the control data is the honeywell's the Sperrys and a whole host of other businesses that have started here have spun off new new Enterprises and their multinational worldwide corporations. It seems to me that they've done quite well in Minnesota in this society. And one of the things that were very proud of is our support of a strong public education system in this state the the the need to have well educated trained workers, very productive workers. The workforce in Minnesota is is probably among the best if not the best educated and productive Workforce in the country. And obviously that pays dividends for employers who hire those kinds of workers rather than continuing this this non productive debate about the cost of doing business the the the complaints about the cost of unemployment insurance and workers. Ben and that's a whole nother subject bobbin. It's something that you could fill up an entire program on and just those two two issues. It seems to me that what we ought to do is spend more time focusing on the things that we do right and then concentrate on fixing the things that need fixing not suggesting there are not things that need attention but to make these blanket indictments of Minnesota of the people of this state and and to suggest that somehow this state is lost. Its Competitive Edge vis-à-vis South Dakota or North Dakota. Those things are nice cliches. There's always an antique doll story or two around that we can point to but the fact of the matter is is that Minnesota and its citizens are working very hard and the labor movements part of that scene, and we'll continue that effort. I'm not about to participate in the discussion and say that this is a terrible place to do business and to work. It isn't we want to make it better than what it is today and on that note. We move along to your question. Go ahead, please Bernie members listening. (00:25:25) Thank you. I guess I'd like to know what your guests might feel about the practice of school teachers going on strike, which really shuts down the educational process for our children and like celery disputes and such things like that. (00:25:44) Okay under the Minnesota public employment Labor Relations Act teachers as members of the workforce have the right to form and to join labor unions. And in fact large numbers of teachers in our public education system in Minnesota have done just that and I would certainly support the right of teachers and all public employees being a public employee union member myself to meet and negotiate with their employers. Sometimes those negotiations break down because of the difficulties that these workers confront. They are not able to reach agreements with their employers and in rare instances a strike results. Nobody likes that situation. I've never talked to a teacher or any other worker for that matter who enjoyed being out on strike they lose wages and they're concerned about getting back in those classrooms and on those jobs and and getting on with Lives but the fact of the matter is that sometimes they are left with no Alternatives. They're simply not able to resolve their differences in any other Manner and the strike is the only vehicle that they have to bring those concerns to the attention of the public. I wish there was another way to do it sometimes binding arbitration mediation. They're all tools that can be used in fortunately those tools more often than not result in agreements being reached but occasionally, there's a strike by teachers and other public employees. I think what we have to do in those situations is to find vehicles that can be used to settle those negotiations and get those people back to work as rapidly as possible and just trying to remember if there are any categories of public employees who are not allowed to strike in Minnesota Bob. There are several the the police and fire uniformed workers the this the essential workers. There's a there's a Mission of essential workers under Minnesota public Labor Relations law public employment Labor Relations law and those workers are in that essential class and category guards at Correctional institutions. And so on they are classified as essential primarily uniformed workers. All right, we have another listing with the question. Go ahead. You're on the air. (00:28:04) No, thank you. I find I turned in tuned in late to the thing. I don't agree with much of what he says, but every program that we have in Minnesota that would Aid business. We have 10 programs that are damaging to business, but that's not the question. I want to ask. Okay. It's about a 10 percent form thought but I wonder why in foreign trade we couldn't have some kind of mechanism to meet the advantages that foreign governments are offering their businesses on an specific industry by industry basis, you know much like we do here or used to have any way you I hear a lot about you could match any price that your competitor was selling without having to. Offer that same price to everybody. I don't even know if that law is applicable anywhere now or not. But (00:28:59) all right, let's get Bernie's responses on that. I would invite your listener Bob to give me a call at our office and we'll discuss the approach of Minnesota to businesses on some other some other day. But with regard to the specific question, I think that's an area, you know where something could be done. One of the things that were aware of of course, is that a number of foreign governments do subsidize their Industries? Then those Industries are selling their particular products in the United States for less than what it costs them to produce that particular item in their own country and the government of that country subsidizes that that particular manufacturing process and that's what's called dumping and we are aware that there's a lot of foreign steel. For example that's been dumped in the United States from several countries around the world. At a price that that was less than what it cost that manufacture in that foreign country to make it so you're right. A lot of the foreign governments are subsidizing their industry and it's hurting our trade and it certainly hurting our Iron Range as we well known. Yes. It is very much. So what do you see as the scenario for the Iron Range boy, it it isn't clear at this point Bob and you know, I applaud the courage and and the dedication and conviction conviction of those workers up there and the people in northeastern Minnesota. They've had great difficulty. The steel industry has just been decimated and the taconite industry up there at the height of the taconite industry. There was something like fourteen to fifteen thousand Steel Workers working up there today that's down to around 4,000 workers. And now we have the strike with USX up there the lockout I should say and those workers are confronting one difficulty after another. So it's very difficult to predict the future. They're battling back. I was in Duluth just yesterday and I see the paper mill that's going up in the West End of Duluth. I know they're trying to diversify visited iron World a month or so ago and I think there's great. Hope for the future on the Iron Range and I we need to encourage that we need to get some new Industries up there to diversify to provide employment opportunities for those people but isn't it false? Hope really wouldn't those folks in large part be better off to move to someplace where there might be a better chance of finding work, even if it isn't that as good as salary as they were Bob what you're asking and what your what's implicitly suggested in your question is is very difficult. Those workers have Roots up there in northeastern Minnesota. They've raised families they have kids in school. They have investments in homes. They have neighbors and family and friends and and I know some workers have dislocated they've up and moved. The parts of the country and in some cases they've come back to Northeastern Minnesota because they haven't been successful in trying to find work in northeastern Minnesota, but it's very difficult to do that. And I think we've all got an obligation particularly the state of Minnesota and I know that the president ministration is working hard to try and find job opportunities for those workers and if we can convince some some entrepreneurs and business enterprises to go up there. I think we can pull ourselves out of the economic difficulties that presently exists on the Iron Range. Here's an opportunity for a listener to ask Bernie Bremer question. Hello. You're on (00:32:29) next. Thank you. I'm calling about the recent merger between on Northwest and Republic. Seems to me that the public has always had a very cordial relationship at least two recent years with its employees and Northwest on the other hand perhaps it's relations are not always been that cordial. What's this merger going to mean to the traveling public we're going to have a fewer services are there will be fewer employees. Are they going to be a cost cutting measures are going to be higher ticket prices just like have your views on that, please. Thank you. (00:33:03) Okay, I can give you my views. I think your question perhaps would better be directed at the management of Northwest Airlines. However, with regard to the impact of the merger on customer relations customer services ticket prices and so on the The Listener Bob is certainly I think correct in his observation that the Labor Relations climate historically in Northwest has been somewhat more Rocky than it has been the with Republic Airlines, but Hopefully those things are behind us and I would hope that they'll make every effort to to have good labor relations with their employees Labor Management relations with the unions that represent the workers in the airline industry and that there wouldn't be any deterioration. In fact an improvement in the level of service that's provided to the traveling public talking about the current state of Labor Relations today with Bernie brummer the secretary treasurer of the Minnesota AFL-CIO and your next what's your question today (00:34:09) occurs to me that the membership of the AFL-CIO our cells lacks in fighting the importation of products the carpenter will drive to work in a foreign car. You will hammer and saw with a hammer made in Japan and he'll buy nails that are made in Taiwan. What effort is the CIO AFL-CIO doing to discourage this type of operation? Are you increasing the dues of those members that use this material or what are you (00:34:44) doing? The question is is a good one and it's of constant concern and attention to the AFL-CIO and the various National and international unions that are affiliated first. Let me say that the Minnesota AFL-CIO or the national AFL-CIO doesn't control the do structure of our Affiliates that's in their autonomous. They determine their own do structure the rank-and-file members make those decisions. So we can't increase their dues if they don't adhere to a particular policy, the the notion of buying Union and buying American is one we've had very intense public relations campaign both within and without in the labor movement of in you know, increasing the awareness in our society of the importance of buying American buying buying Union made Goods if at all possible and we do have those members. However, the hopefully they're in the minority that just don't seem to get the message. We can't force people to do things. This is a free Society but we're making a lot of effort to try and convince them that they're just hurting themselves when they buy foreign cars foreign-made products and and it's not in their best interest to continue that behavior. So we are working on that and will continue to do so in the future seeing a big shift in the US economy and it's been very very widely reported and talked about from manufacturing to the so-called service industry. And I wonder how that is affecting labor union organizing efforts and membership and so on. You're correct Bob in that there is a shift and what has happened, of course is that there's been a decline in the in the membership of the union and in the success in the organizing area traditionally and historically labor unions have been heavily organized in the manufacturing sector. That was the membership base and with the shift that we're seeing in our economy from manufacturing to Services. We're less organized there. Although a number of unions are focusing attention on organizing in the servicing industry the banking and insurance industry the healthcare industry the public sector there have been some organizing drives and there will continue to be so in the future but it presents the labor movement with a very large challenge. We're going to have to figure out how to organize those workers how to communicate the goals and the objectives of the labor movement to those workers, but we have some problems, you know, a lot of those service jobs are part-time there. Low wage jobs and it's difficult sometimes to access those workers. Hmm. Let's move on to some more listeners with questions talking with Bernie brahmer about labor today. Hello. You're on the air. (00:37:30) Good morning. Good morning. Just recently a merger between TWA and Frontier Airlines was effectively killed because he wa could not come to an agreement with their pilots Union the pilots at TWA did not want the frontier Pilots to come in at a lesser wage than they were being paid for. The reason that I'm told that it would effectively curtailed. Their own bargaining power to result is 4,700. People are out of work in Colorado and a lot of places do not have Airline service and I'm wondering how this kind of incident will affect the image. Of unions in this country an image that I think some people may find some what- already. (00:38:28) I'm not sure that I agree with the listener Bob with regard to the underlying reason for Frontier Airlines filing bankruptcy. I think if I'm not mistaken Frontier was owned by people Airlines. It was a subsidiary of people are lines or people Express whatever they call it. There's so many of these companies nowadays in some of them are simply shells or holding companies. But so it's difficult sometimes to figure out in our society anymore who owns what but be that as it may I don't have any specific information or knowledge regarding the pilots for TWA being responsible for Frontier Airlines having to file bankruptcy. That sounds a little bit far-fetched to me and it's just something that I'm not able to comment on and so we'll move on to your question. Go ahead Bernie Brothers listening. Hello, (00:39:22) go ahead. Sorry to hear you're organized labor person. I'm sorry. You didn't have an organized labor, which is by far the largest group there to share that program with her believe I'm sorry to hear in reiterating the same old story about the Iron Range and about a good many other parts of business. I don't think he's serving his people. Well, if you just listen to the programs that are made available through your stations public television commercial networks and the business sector of our society, we learned through three years ago from professors of Economics specializing in the steel industry. Don't go birds that die from Notre Dame and many others that for at least two decades. They had been watching what was happening in the steel industry and exactly what they had been writing about predicting with happening that it was going to diminish in this country and with greater richness State and was just never going to come back to where it was. Never be totally without it, but it was going to change quite radically. And right now Japan is experiencing the same thing that we did there now begrudging the business that Korea is getting and we just heard last night there was free and then the big National programs on the General Motors in the other companies cutting their financing costs and they said General Motors has to do something their costs are totally out of control and we have to notice in Union contract and so on that they're demanding no Outsourcing and the financial people tell us some of these diff they can't Outsource their going to go broke and I just think that you've got to get up to today. This is a World Market we can do lots of wonderful things to the market. We can't do it with rigid regimented. They were Union laws and with some of the very high-priced they was priced Beyond it's worth in the marketplace (00:41:19) Okay, so Let's get Bernie's reaction to that. I want to react to that and I won't comment on the listeners observation that I'm not serving our membership. The members of the Minnesota. AFL-CIO will determine that because I serve in an elective position but be that as it may you know, we have a crisis and I don't think anybody would argue. Otherwise in the Rural America in the farm community and this old adage about Labor pricing itself out of the market wages and and restrictive work rules and so on pricing US Labor out of the market I think is something that will be addressed by this story. But the farm economy is suffering. I think what a lot of us would characterize as a depression, but here we have American farmers. They have some of the best most productive land in the world in Minnesota. I think that's especially true they have the Just Machinery that's made anywhere in the world. They have the best seed the best fertilizer and to suggest that the American Farmer isn't productive is simply on the face of it. Not a fact we all know that they're productive and yet they can't make a living their products are selling around the world at record low rates and it must be because they've priced themselves out of the market, right? I think your listeners Bob will understand that there's something wrong in this equation in the area of Labor Management relations Imports and the trade deficit that just isn't adding up the listener used the phrase the same old story. Well perhaps but I heard the The Listener use or phrase that I would characterize as the same old rhetoric and we talked about the marketplace letting the market determine how things are going going to be affected and and that simply doesn't work in our estimation because if it did why can't us Farmers compete in the world markets, well on the other handle wouldn't you say that the wage concessions and rollbacks and givebacks that some unions agreed to or at least some sort of tacit admission that maybe their prices were too high. Well, I I suspect that you could hold that view. I think more realistically however, those workers would were confronted by threats by their employers that they were going to close the plants that they were going to move overseas, whatever and they were simply a pragmatic recognition of those workers that if they didn't agree to some concessions and incidentally that Concession Street isn't one way in a lot of those collective bargaining agreements those workers have gained things from the employer in terms of profit sharing plans in terms of representation in some way shape or form in the management decision-making process and safety concessions and so on and so forth. So collective bargaining is a two-way street sure five minutes before 12 noon and we have more listeners and we're going to be able to do with but let's get as many on as we can. Go ahead please you're (00:44:42) next. All right. Good morning. I have a question about leather coats in America. We are I play a country that eats most meat than any other country in the world and yet what happens to the heights why our leather coats so expensive. Why do I have to go and buy if I want a good pair of shoes? I have to go and buy Italian shoes instead of American shows that I cannot afford if I want to buy a leather coat. I probably buy it that is made in Europe because it's better made it has a better lining. So with the purses what happens to the hide I (00:45:28) think all right. Let's see what Bernie has to say on this. I don't know if he's got a lot of insight. Yeah. I'm not I'm not privy to how the the leather industry functions. But again, I think it's symptomatic and I know you're the listeners right? There are a lot of leather goods imported into the United States and the listener observed that the cost is very very high. We know that the wages that are paid to those workers are just a few cents an hour. If not a dollar an hour and why should they be so high if you know the employers that are importing these leather goods into this country have such low wages that they can pay their workers. So I think it's a good analogy and it it it supports what I've been saying earlier. Let's take your question next. Go ahead. Please bring your bombers listening. (00:46:18) Yes. I've heard your comment and understand your position on foreign government subsidizing materials are then shipped to this country. What is your position? However, when our government is the one that's doing the subsidizing and then exporting Goods, I think most recent well documented instance was a grain sale to run (00:46:41) wheat him. Yeah. I don't know if that's any more proper than than what the what the other governments are doing in terms of subsidizing their respective. Exports. I know there's been a hue and cry in the United States and there were members in the Reagan Administration itself that disagreed with the with the decision. So I think that speaks for itself. All right, we have time for one. Maybe two more will try you next. Go ahead, please. (00:47:07) Yes. I've been listening the program. I just caught a little bit about the airline industry. I work for an airline here in the Twin Cities and you know talking about concessions on that. We gave up quite a bit at Republic and before they were taken over by Northwest 15 percent of our paycheck to paycheck. And if it weren't for the Union's doing that Republic wouldn't be around right now and what your caller said about a two-way street is absolutely true and it's amazing to me that a person like the chairman of the board of that company can lose 111 million dollars and then as voted by the board of directors to be the president of the company and he is replaced by another person a chairman of the board a new chairman of the board is essentially he was kicked upstairs. He kept his salary of I don't know how many hundred thousand dollars a year, you know, if I run into an airplane on the ramp, I'm fired. That's that's all there is to it or at least I face disciplinary action, you know, and that may cost a few thousand dollars and yet this person can lose a hundred and eleven million dollars and they give him a promotion. So I think that there's a place for unions. I think you have to have that balance between management and the union itself. And also I think I would like it if Could briefly comment if you know anything about Nucor steel, which I understand is a (00:48:30) company where we have less than half a minute, so I'm afraid I won't be able to let you finish your question. Very brief. Comment Bernie just to wrap things up. Well, the the caller I think was was right American management. I think needs to look at their own house, and then figure out if the decisions that they're making are in the best interests of the of the industrial policy of this country and the labor movement will do it here Bernie Bremer. Thank you very much for coming in on this Labor Day holiday to thank you to us. Bernie Rumer is secretary treasurer of the Minnesota AFL-CIO thanks to engineered Dorothy engineer David sleep Dorothy Hanford answer the telephones. Actually. It was very gordimer at the controls. I don't know what happened to David. He must have taken off for his nap or something weekend is made possible by economics laboratory products and services for household institutional and Industrial Cleaning worldwide. Bob Potter speaking. This is ksjn Minneapolis. St. Paul the news and information service of Minnesota Public Radio and speaking of napping. I think. Mr. Danielson is back. Is he not off there? He is Dan wake up. It's time to go back to work. Oh my goodness. Thank you very much Bob Potter and we want to remind you and all of our listeners that programming on Minnesota Public Radio is made possible in part by CPT Corporation providing office automation systems worldwide. Good afternoon. It's 30 seconds past twelve o'clock Danielson sitting in for Mark I said who will be with you again next Saturday and we are just moments away from J.G. Preston the human Sports tornado who is entering the studio and he'll be talking with guests about college football recruitment, but we have just a couple of minutes to pass along some news headlines and just a bit of new weather information as well. And news headlines at this hour the Soviet Secret Police have detained an American reporter for questioning. The KGB says Nicholas Daniel off the Moscow correspondent for us news and world report is being held at a KGB facility in eastern Moscow so far. The KGB has refused to say why Daniel off is being held eight US Marines are believed to have lost their lives in the crash of a helicopter during military exercises in the North Atlantic the sea Knight helicopter crashed during takeoff from the deck of the USS. Saipan two bodies have been recovered six others are missing a couple of local news headlines. Unfortunately, both of them fatalities Anoka County authorities have identified three of the four people who died in a house fire early today in Coon Rapids, three of the victims were a mother and her two young children. They are identified as 38 year-old Denise Ramona doorman and her two children.