It's five minutes past twelve. This is midday on Minnesota Public Radio. We're going to spend the rest of the hour here or most of it. Anyway talking about politics with two guys who just love politics and love to talk politics. They sort of eat it and breathe it day in and day out DJ Larry and Wyman Spa know who among other things collaborate on a newsletter. That's rather popular in political circles called politics in Minnesota gentlemen, welcome. Thank you for coming out. I'll tell you this you and I am Wineman at the three that know it and I thought about a half a dozen others that might know there was an election day in Minneapolis-Saint Paul Duluth and number of other cities, but every place we called with some exceptions in Duluth Duluth had a little more controversy than anything did in the the Twin Cities area has the most people really weren't that interested and the turn off.Horrendously low turnouts in the primaries and yesterday's general election turnouts weren't that much higher except where there were a couple of contests of interest you make anything of the results of me. We had one incumbent lose in St. Paul and we had the in Minneapolis Lee one seat that have been Republican went to a Democrats are there now? No Republicans in Minneapolis city council Wyman.that's a Kind unfortunate but they didn't have any opponents and there was nothing to talk about. Now we're having a little trouble with the microphone there. Why men like to hear a women? That's right. There wasn't that much there in Chicago to get a mic that works. There is something to look not so much at the results of the election but both had what I mentioned in terms of the primary and the general when low turnouts are low is they work? Set an awful lot about existing city government people have a fairly satisfied with it there. There aren't any things to get upset about usually they those things that people run against individual Alderman councilman, whatever the city happens to call them and older people they still don't they still call it Alderman over there. They don't make the sex has changed on it. So I don't want to offend anybody but it generally means with those exceptions were there might be a local Ward issue or something that that the Publican at large is pretty satisfied with the way things are going in city government not upset over the things you get upset about what you're spending and taxes and seem to be going along pretty good. I think it's time to go out the phone number to let those who have some questions for political observers get them into 276 thousand in Minneapolis. And st. Paul DJ Larry and why Spano are here talking about politics to 276 thousand in the Twin Cities elsewhere within the state of Minnesota are toll free number is 1 800-652-9700 1 800-652-9700. And if you're listening and one of the surrounding states, you can call us directly at area code 612-227-6000 from today. It'll be the day after the 86 general election. Who do you think will be governor of Minnesota first will correct you owe a year from yesterday will be the day after November 4th. 1986 will be okay if somebody my friend Frank freezing, I was just up the governor's office for the other news conference in Frank handed me as he's kind to do one of those calendars for 1986. What day is election day? So as you is Bobby said that we tend to eat breathing sleep politics, but I ate it looked it up. So it's the first Tuesday in 1986 is November 4th. Okay, so it'll be generally speaking the same day the day after the election and I think we will wake up and find out that Rudy perpich has been re-elected Wyman do agree with that. Oh, I think you have to am I working now? Yeah, you're working. It's working. The mic is on. I love to watch DJ work. I was kind of hoping to just sit back and watch the whole thing. There's a lot of rumor is everybody knows about the governor making funny moves. Like he really isn't going to be here. Like he really wants to go to Austria and settle down and be a business person and let somebody else run the state of Minnesota and those are fun rumors to fool with but there really isn't enough substance yet to get anything out of it. So yeah, if if the governor stays he's probably going to win but I think it's changing and there's a lot he's got a lot of trouble ahead trouble that comes from I can Academy turning down in the States budget. Being difficult we give ourselves trouble in Minnesota because our tax system is so terribly subject to ups and downs. It's not a broad base system, especially in the sales tax Aryan. So the receipts tend to fluctuate very rapidly and you can't ever get so they can't ever seem to get a real good handle on it, especially when we're going the wrong way and the income tax goes up and down dramatically to align with questions. Let's so go to some of the colors and find out what's on your mind this afternoon how you're on the air? I am DJ are both right but I can't agree on the point of people being satisfied Minneapolis said DJ. Have you been talking to people on the street? So they're bewildered as I am. Well I eat, you know, the reason that you sent that I think Bill is that you have a great sensitivity those issues. I run into three people that are a little upset by tax increment financing that is I've always said only even the people who use tackett's increment financing can explain it. You have a greater sensitivity some of those issues because you have a broader understanding but I don't see the people marching down at City Hall upset about things that are occurring from merdan freezers leadership or from the things that are happening it in the city council. The race is two races. We had Minneapolis issuer one was a retirement Charlie quite decided not to run again and the other one was in the Third Ward wear if they don't have an election they decide to fight anyway, so I'm not sure that that anybody in any one of those Ward's pulled anything significant 20 30% that it was about the biggest opposition over and in some of those words around the university in that and it was just token opposition at best and you don't go looking at it and in the end the big picture like you political scientists tend to do that was important my degree was in so I can sympathize with that. But if you if you look at the cities over the last 10 years or so, they really have used various creative and somewhat a strange methods of funding development and that's been okay in the cities have remained relatively vibrant, but going forward we got real trouble the feds cutting money off the state having trouble with money. Now we're looking at I think this is probably didn't my guess is the last election where we're really not going to have much trouble because it's all pretty steady state heck the city hasn't raised its mill rate in years. And those are the kinds of issues that people get to know about now we're going to have to re Start raising money through more property taxes through fees on all kinds of services that we used to get in for nothing all those things going to start to hit us now more listeners waiting. Also a couple of lines open to 276 thousand is the telephone number to call if you have a question about politics in Minnesota for Wyman Spano and DJ Larry your next to him, please Hello. Hello, this is someone from Duluth Minnesota politics very much in your Minnesota magazine political magazine. And then what was your opinion of the election results in the world High voter turnout in Duluth in a one of the reasons when we were talking about the election here just at the start that we didn't concentrate too much on Duluth is cuz we we pick the race wrong up there a 12-year incumbent by on the Saint Paul city are the excuse me Duluth city council was defeated in yesterday's election and they will recall ever in my remarks at the beginning of the program. I said with the exception of Duluth particular races the local it campaigns didn't get too heated up and that was a significant campaign that quite in fact, you could trace its roots back over a year to that. Human rights read gay rights ordinance that was proposed and defeated at the poles that carried over into two elections now and I think went a long way towards defeating made by who it introduced the ordinance. Okay, we'll take another listen to with a question. Go ahead please you're on the air. Why indeed you are listening Abu votes and who doesn't vote in recent years whether there is any single group that stands out markedly as defecting in What's called the dude he could vote. The weather it's just a very general phenomenon cutting across all factions and ages. I I I don't see any studies showing people that are doing more hands sitting you might be able to make some inferences and then if you'll halfway or still around he probably have some more learning study so properly available cuz he's always got them. But what we see in the stuff that we read about about organizations and groups that cold under various banners. Most of them. I must say in the in the last couple years generally of the religious right social issues lie with the religious, right and with the religious family issues and they are mustering up more people to get out and vote and they stand up not so much as a group that didn't vote before but are coalescing as I set under one Banner. Would you think that from the stuff? I've seen the same Tendencies exist. It's it's kind of down across the board. That is People with higher incomes tend to vote more people with higher education tend to Biltmore in off-year elections. They tend to be relatively more quote conservative unquote and sometimes that can meet Volta me voting Democratic. It doesn't always mean voting Republican but there is a there's a bumper sticker DJ me the point about the social issues. There is a bumper sticker that says I'm pro-choice and I vote that bumper stickers not true. Generally speaking. I mean they're there is not a correlation between there is a correlation between being pro-life and voting there is not one necessarily between pro-choice Mowing and so people who are pro-choice people who are interested in family issues people who are gun control an interested in not having gun control those people tend to vote more than the general population. I think it should be said here that it serves the interests of certain segments of this. Population cross this country not to have people vote and In Minnesota where one of the very few states that encourages people to vote by having election day registration something survived by not voting. Well people who are in a menorah T. So there if you can get ahold of your group, you know, I mean we have we have high-tech running crazy these days and you could vote so easily you could vote with your telephone by pushing that crosshatch. I mean you can you can call up Ted Koppel at night and vote on major issues. You cannot vote for the water commissioner. You've got to get our senior citizens and frail and infirm on a November Tuesday into a car and down sometimes on ice and what have you and into a polling place to be able to try and read the ballot and I and I push a lever it has for a long time. So certain interest in this country not to encourage people to get out and vote and I must tell you that last year in the national election. There was a lot of that said that we shouldn't be Cuz there were more tax consumers then taxpayers who would then go to the polls and vote Minnesota. We rank up in the seventies usually in percentage of participation on the boat. And I think it's because we have election day registration. That's DJ Larry Weiss Bona was with him. They collaborate on a newsletter called politics in Minnesota which were talking about today on the day. If you have a question or an observation to 276 thousand in Minneapolis and st. Paul elsewhere within the state of Minnesota. The number is one 800-652-9700. Take another listening. I'll go ahead please your on the are confusing if you move into the state from elsewhere, then you find that Minneapolis has a strong Council weak-mayor kind of thing, which is a change a little bit. Is it true that You're not going to vote for Democratic you move to the suburbs. And then now that the interregnum suburbs is graying. Are they more intensely Republican? They vote on a Sunday. They have 80 90% And A lot of people won't make the effort to adjust their work out or something to get to the polling place. And then when I got intrigued enough to go to my first caucus meaning because of the abortion issue I found it was a railroad from beginning to end and there was a click that determined everything which is not one man. One vote the process that I was taught in school things to chew on their side. Christine think that weak mayor strong Council there whatever might be in any city is interesting. You should have been here. What was it maybe 15 years ago before they change the charger in St. Paul MN was one of the few things we learned through school and same father I've ever has only two cities in America had a commission form of government St. Paul was one of them where you elected Commissioners who ran the police department ran the library or the stadia as it said and I could never find more than one Stadium from those days, but you're right that is confusing and I think you touch a very important or when you talk about the caucuses in the dfl party if you want to be truly effective, but at a caucus you cannot as an uninformed citizen or just a casual informed citizen go to a caucus and work your way. You got to be a Harvard graduate from Harvard Law School to be able to figure out some of those rules for sub caucusing and how you do all this prancing around and find two or three people that support cracks in the sidewalk. Walk-in Mother Love and preservation whooping crane a couple other vital issues that they talk about those caucuses in order to affect your way. You cannot walk in off the street and say I'm one person one vote and I ought to be able to effexor and you write your observation about those caucuses is carrying itself out. I think in the way we treat the political parties here in Minnesota now, I mean, the DJs favorite line is they have become simply a mailing address and a telephone and that in some ways has got to be true of the dfl party has gone through three chairs and in what 12 months which tells you that must be great upheaval in that party and it also when you stop to think of a little effect it had on anyting I bought her a bunch of the name all three of them real quick. Ruth Ruth, you know, you and DJ and I and maybe that's three other people who can do that. And the the reality is that that whole process we've just there's been sort of a feeling among voters that this is craziness the walk in there and get up and sub talks about if I walk rap and dust we begin to not trust the whole endorsement process and and then we don't buy it, but we already had a chance to change it recently but decided not to, but let's let's look at this. Let's have our listeners list suggest this that we should have open primaries. Then we need to have for a party and show you have to protect your right to exist. I mean, there's no reason in state law of parties are contained in state law to have parties if you don't have caucuses so they have gone over the Capitol and testified against presidential primaries saying that we know better as a party we can sort out all these people and check their credentials the fact of the matter is that Longevity and seniority generally matter more in a party structure that then credentials and aptitude for a particular job and then we'll tell you who you got to vote for in a primer and the people this state have been sending these parties a message now for number of years, but they still haven't been getting the message. I got to tell you though that from from my perspective that I kind of long for the days of the strong parties in some way I long for the days of leadership in congress where the speaker meant something. I had a congressman Monday tell me and I said you can't ever quote me. The Tip O'Neill is a joke. He can't discipline anybody for anything. There are no votes here anymore that we have to do and the bus broken up. There's no group that really tries to implement its policy over a broad base and that's the special interest and in single interest become more powerful because that becomes what you vote on a bat's why I mean we we had an interview the other night with Set a reminder for its public television on The Allman extra one. I asked him and he denied it but I think it's true that gramm-rudman is enormous constitutional transfer of power to the presidency because it's essentially saying alright, we give up we cannot do this job anymore. We can't cut the budget. So we're just going to do it automatically that the president do a 2% across-the-board when certain things don't happen. And that's to me simply a reflection of the fact that the Congress cannot discipline itself anymore because we've lost the party's let's get some more listener questions and go ahead please you're on the air with that the biggest and sitting thing I see is Pollution of the Mississippi by especially by Minneapolis the same path we have small towns in the Southeast corner and then I'm from Winona, but we have a small towns near us that have populations under 500 people who have had to put in sediment Pond and and pumping stations for their sewage and the Twin Cities when it rains. When do you smoke sir? Well, then you're not going to have to pay for it to your friends and neighbors that I don't smoke either so you and I can take an extra deep breath and I hope that what you're talking about csoh known as CSL combined sewer overflow. You're absolutely right that the 8 or 10 times a year when it rains and the Twin Cities the people Downstream and I get the results of the sewer overflow into the river and the state of Wisconsin is file a lawsuit in federal district court and it could be for City of Saint Paul Minneapolis and South Saint Paul, I believe the three at the house later wrestled with this last session because if they didn't do it the courts were going to order it and what it came out as I think there's an extra nickel tax on cigarettes, which is going to cso so where you have a right to be a little upset would be the few of the people and many other cities and Suburban cities around the metro area are perfect examples on their own tax base. They paid for having the right kind of sanitary sewer system the older Central City's who built these systems many many years to go frequently before there were Suburban cities or smaller States cities did not did not build them Evie the new cities paid for it other tax base now. Buddy is going to pay for it for the for the the two major cities out of the cigarette tax. Okay, it says 27 past 12 and we'll take another listener. Hello. You're on the air. I'm at work and I'm not sure what his comments were but I did hear that. It's probably just before I turn the radio off and he called I'm wondering who enforces or who coordinates the voting laws in Minnesota Secretary of State. Is the law is there not a person of the light it says it's on a polling data flag has to be displayed on the outside of the polling place. I don't know if that's in the state. I don't know if I got to tell you that I know there's a lot of pretty good. I mean, I know how many feet away you got to be before you can hand up and you can talk to anybody and things like that. I have always assumed that I was never I was kind in the Dumber all the time in school. So I always look for the flag because they're pulling places over the years. I've lived in so many different places that if they didn't have the flag out the heavens knows I would never be able to find it the jurors not have one. Hello you there? Did your did your polling place not have a flag about politics here with DJ and lie, go ahead you're on the air? And you think there's a chance when upset and 1/7. Thank you. I recognize that voice is going to be a little touchy touchy because the dfl governor the state went to Washington a couple weeks ago and worked out a deal with the Republican and coming from the 7th District Ghana an amendment to the house farm bill and amendment. That was so widely accepted. I must tell you it only got 52 votes but it enraged the dfl office folders in the 7th District and others because it gave him were talking about Congressman Island staying let me give him a kind of a new status and an alliance with the Rudy perpich are portrayed him is doing everything possible to help the farmers and they had hoped to have that issue to do to run on up there. One of the reality is is that the candidate in the seven. The center Collin Peterson last time seems to be clearly in the race again, and he seems to be doing it in a different way this time. He seems to be better Organized Noize. He's organizing himself. He had a large staff meeting over a weekend that just last weekend. I believe and hired a consultant out of what happened and it's it's coming down to look like the start of a better campaign just in an organizational sense and the farmers are hurting and whenever farmers are hurting you can sometimes get in it incumbent. However, you got to keep in mind that it's a little hard for a state senator of the opposition party who is an accountant and a bandleader to go up against the farmer goes that it what is traditionally been the case up there. Is that black dirt Norwegian Lutheran Farmers, so make the best candidates and they run that way and the dfl. As many painful lessons over the number of years since Arlen stangland got in which start back to the Mike Sullivan days putting up candidates who didn't get that profile with what seems to be the case that in that District the kind of profile that Bob Bergland Francis felt. This is the other thing. I've heard them calling this time. Is he buried himself in those Farm issues and he's just doing so much stuff with it that he's trying to identify with that issue as much as he can but you just right he's not one, you know any of those beautiful know and I know there's some kind of a farmer's Brigade campaign and I could be very effective but I got to tell you on the farm issue then whoever gets up every day and kind of gives a good Kick In The Shins or wherever you kick people to the Reagan Administration for the farm policy. So he's he's right in line. And they're Tim penny is on that the egg Committee in the house in the first district and depending on on what they do Dairy Farmers down there will probably sell an awful lot there. Jim Oberstar is doesn't seem to ever have any problem there. The Sikorsky race was the one that had the biggest challenge the last time the 6th District and I suspect they'll put up a date and I'll try again. I suspect that candidate again is going to be close to the right people who have traditionally been involved with fundamental churches and now are really involved in politics. That's that's the strongest area of that is the is kind of them the first Suburban ring, you know that the lower level homes not the diners, but the That would appear to me from geography. That's 6 district for the Horseshoe horseshoe District across the northern suburbs, and I have to be the most difficult to unseat him in, didn't know because it's a very difficult District 2 campaign it there are no Communications tools. You can use a blanket that the eastern part of the district in the western part of District. You just got to go out to pick up votes at retail him means a lot of working. It's in and Sikorsky does incredible constituency service in while he's in office party. Well, I think he's he's done better. They can always take him out. If they want to they can never be too. I mean, I just don't think they can either I think they've decided that you know friends Alyssa fact of life there. He isn't getting in their way. We were talking when we say he their way they generally religious right pro-family a groups from that area who have a different agenda and I are offended by you by bills a willingness to stand up and vote for title 10 Family Planning money and things like that. They think that their agenda can be handled in probably some other ways rather than falling on their sword over Bill friends. Loudest wireless music questions for DJ Larry and why Spano go ahead with your own they are not be able to be said that the Louver voter turnout in Minneapolis the same Paul indicated that the voters in general were quite pleased with the policies of the democratic group who's currently in office on a national level / 2/4 turn out was somehow reflective of some type of Insidious plot to the movie light by Republicans prevent people from voting. Was that Republican to do that blatting? It's everybody know I am I think I'm talking about the the mechanics of the election. I'm not sure you can relate the two things that I'm talking about. The Baxter. It is very difficult. In other states to vote isn't difficult Minnesota if it isn't difficult Minnesota and people decide to stay home. They must be pleased with what's going on. I see no problem with that. Alright, let's move on the lion DJ listening. Go ahead. Please never seems to comment on the role of campaign ethics laws in that demise. It seems to me that those laws by limiting the ability of parties to fund and work for the candidate that kind of force them into the arms of special interest groups in order to get the resources that they need like it or not to run a successful modern campaign Well, you know the first of all of the dfl party in Minnesota does not raise any money for candidates generally speaking in some instances they do and the mother's milk of politics has his money in campaign funding and a few so I don't think so the rules of reporting in that in terms of the campaign ethical practices laws have really forced people away from the party structure and over who was the Pax. I think the parties were not the source of the parties in all of the Republicans do better candidates have always gotten most of their money outside the party at a frat as the party gave you the people gave you the horses and all the rest of it, but they didn't necessarily be used to be a fairly well in the Minnesota Legislature for the parties are the candidates weren't even party a designated and so as a consequence the relationship between Legislature in the party was was very tenuous at best one of the great increases and cost and campaigning you might tend overlooked but it goes back to this thing about the role that the parties had 10 20 years ago when they would provide bodies as Wyman said is that now you can no longer expect as you could 15 or 20 years ago that you you know, somebody will send over a busload of Housewives who will and I and I use that term because that's just the way these I will get some housewives in here to lick stamps and fold in Florida and do that you now have to pay people to handle your campaign for you can get some volunteer help but by and large people in this day and age of enlightenment just don't believe you should say subject. Mostly. It was women in those days to the hours of the campaign in the work that you expect without giving him something you've commented on your predictions for the Governor's chair. And for the congressional seats. How about the legislature? What do you think? There we will learn a lot about that. Bob in the next 5-6 months. I would say the most telling one might be the April Revenue projections. When you think that the following the house is smarting beginning to lose some people and will probably lose some more they lost the chairman of the tax committee for the former chairman a TextMe John Tomlinson. Very good legislator. There's something about being in the minority that isn't nearly as much fun as being there trying to get it back but I still have a sense that that the dfl right now isn't for something that seems to be the Republicans are for something which is less of something less of everything and the dfl doesn't have quite that charge going in. So I'd have to guess that that won't change much that the if I had to guess now I'd say that Republicans will remain in control in the house speakers. Is incredibly Adept at the game of running the place getting good coverage got a great sense of humor and just that whole combination makes him. if he'd run for governor, I think it would be probably someone a different story but he says he isn't going to he's also been able to exactly what we I can't remember seeing and Dashing 14 15 years of dfl control party discipline our caucus discipline for lack of better and he does an extraordinary job on it and it's very hard to be on the outs up against somebody that can figure out your Maneuvers pretty good. The problem is women has said with the dfl in Minnesota for the legislative things. They could they could solve this problem, but it's not unlike the Democratic party nationally is that nobody knows who they are and what they stand for anymore that's significantly different than the opposition number one or is in step with where they want to be and in this state with the suggestions of a little red ink on the horizon. Things are basically pretty good at least people perceive them in the in this business is perception that counts I have a couple of lines open again to 276 thousand if you tried earlier with a question for a y spawn on DJ Larry might get through now and will take another listen to go ahead please you're on the air for things. He stated on that one. Was that the pro-choice don't vote and pro-life does I wonder if he's aware of that fact that the pro-choice has actually taken over the dfl party and I speak of this from experience cuz I was on at the FL State Central Committee in 1978. I remember the battles that was waged between short and freezer and when short defeated freezer, we then the most people in the dfl party who are pro-choice and refused to help and as a result, we elected two Republican Senators that year and since then unless you are a pro-choice. They don't really care what other issue you're in for unless you're for that you get nowhere. As a result many people have been turned off in the dfl party and they no longer feel any allegiance to attend ballet on the other side of Klein Republican party is doing the same thing on the extreme, right and they're going to write high for a few years. They won't let anyone else in unless they share their views and they're going to have the same problem maybe 10 years down the road can't disagree because the the the pro-choice people do it. I wouldn't say they didn't work and they had and then it's true. They are in control the apparatus of the dfl party, but it's also true that there are endorsed candidates are getting beat. It's true that in the legislature. The number of dfl pro-life members is much larger than you would expect it to be given the official stand of the party and the fact that the apparatus is controlled by people who are pro-choice. It's the point is that I think they can control the party as much as they want. But people are not responding to that in the same. I mean the people who vote are the people who are pro-life and that that's why they're winning. The governor is a good example. I'm pro-choice people vote and they and all the poles would indicate the pro-choice people people who support the 1972 Roe versus Wade Amendment decision of the Supreme Court are in the majority and they continued generally being a majority but they are not motivated to vote on that issue. They have a whole range of issues and they don't get out and blocked basically because they don't have a kind of a a meeting for him the people on the other side of the issue have a secondary meeting form that draws them together and propels them out and it's generally their churches. It's interesting. I was erasing St. Paul that was very close soon. John Drew and Kevin Acklin yesterday and one of the things that happens in that particular Ward is it is the site of the Planned Parenthood on Ford Parkway and that is kind of a physical location that keeps reminding everybody in that word constantly of this issue, you know, there's there's and there are churches there where they every Sunday ask for a sign up on Pickett sheets and that whole so if you take a pro-life and pro-choice candidate there you've got this instant availability of people who are willing to vote on one issue. Non-issue only. I think that's important if you if you look at 4, so I'll close Kaepernick and came to John Drew in that and then you look good. Oh you look at a district like de colon representative. Who if you look at the Mandel vote last year and the corn voting that and what is pretty much nothing precisely the same as that ward in in Highland Park to percent Democratic dfl vote a year ago when everybody was around the rest of the saying world is voting the other way in terms of the Mondale Reagan election. So that's clearly found it divided between a candidate who is pro-life and pro-choice in that area. You see the results as we saw him yesterday questions. We will go to you next time I M near analysis of so-called border satisfaction. I really sparked a lot of reaction. So much satisfaction. Anyway, I was struck by what made me an interesting Nexus between what took place on yesterday is calling show at this time on NPR talk about market analysis and how it in and of itself precludes any create creativity since they ask people what do you like now and the two critics agreed that yes, it would probably put down with the most recently become aware ever had I had come across and I'm wondering if too much market analysis and political campaign true issues campaigning. I'm wondering if somebody like you would Humphrey would have marketed analyzing yourself right out of politics some 40 years ago. What do you call Moe? Single-handedly brought the race issue before the nation? If you think that the prep stuff this this Old South how thick does dead in that the people just because they are satisfied. You're not really worried about issues anymore. I think we're reading more into what I said before. They mean there. I think there are issues out there and plenty that can be raised as much as Bill Hathaway. It said one of the early calls here, but and then there's so many other factors than just issues that come into campaign and you raise Humphrey. Let me tell you that we used to get heading into an election and we talked about it and he needs a mate while they're going to call me Big Spender to Harvard or Columbia and and participate in a panel after the elections and you would bring out all of your polling in the opposition people would be there and they bring out there pulling in their points. The same thing that are that people perceive Humphrey is a big spender. So they thought it's how you use your your marketing information in that and what you sent out. There is really the total picture that's within the mind of the electorate that you want to play off so that your analysis to the art critics has is certainly valid but I think what it would take if you wanted the stem some opposition and you had an issue is that you would have to have a sense of the fluff. We've got an old saying in our business set an election is no time for voter education. I mean that sounds horrendous, but it makes the point if you got an issue that you've got to educate people about you don't have an issue with her four-year against you you're right about one thing and that is that, you know, both DJ and I like politicians generally speaking, but The ones who are so tied to their poles that they're absolutely does. Nothing left except however, things are going and there are few though. Not many put a few those people like you get kind of tired of its there has to be in every campaign every good campaign. And that's why he would Humphrey this great. I mean they did the traditional political things. They knew what was going on. But in his soul there was some stuff he knew too and he went with his soul sometimes and he went with timing sometimes it's all kind of messy, but that's what political leadership is all about and you can't do that essentially and totally on poles move on The Night Listener who has a question or comment. Go ahead. Please run their friend help for Kennedy to my choice usually be defeated. And that is said in this state. I've actually it's a reverse of a lot of other states. So they're Pros in this state are as far as using a manipulating the media tend to be the dfl and often times the real pros in other states. Are are there were there were there IR of the Republican organizations, but I've often consider getting one of these big fat softballs or maybe going down to Chicago where they play kitten ball which is even easier to hit and labeling a d f l coverage and and mailing it to two organizations in town who are almost function as the spokesman for the dfl party. And that would be the Minneapolis Star and Tribune and I believe Minnesota Public Radio. How do I got to die under wheat germ the holes we do. We get to things I've always sort of intrigued me in Minnesota politics one is the business climate is You know, I stayed is just terrible. I mean we have the worst business climate and and I don't frankly believe that and I think everything we know tends to say it ain't so, you know, we have lower unemployment. We have higher educated people live longer at set a timer and as a consequence, this is a good place to be in the business climate wasn't all that bad to begin with. We do pay more. That's the second thing is the papers are always something now. I can tell you when we go to Republican groups. They will tell us how they are dfl Arts. Then we go to the Adele groups. They will tell us that's why they're Carbon on poor Rudy right now and that's why the Republicans are in control the house because it was lousy right-wing newspapers are all by John we run out of time, but I'm going to run a little money and nobody would $150 level. Yeah for politics in Minnesota on the 4th anniversary of our newsletter on July 1st. I think that can be arranged. I really think it can be arranged and it's the kind of thing that when nobody travels estate like we do and we can just hit that little scan button on the radio is were going from place to place and we can hear Bob Potter at midday all over the state. That might be a reason to cut back on your contribution this year cuz I'm going to get to the phone as soon as we finish our business. Will you go to the Light Side to deal with obvious? This is where they get a lot of their information they have to because it's only one that gives it all to us. Why is mono and DJ Larry who are not paid for that political announce? Thank you gentlemen, both very much their the editors of politics in Minnesota a newsletter. That is widely regarded by those in the know in politics. The time is now about 8 minutes before 1. It's membership week on Minnesota Public Radio Mark. I said here we are about the business at this hour to encourage you to go to your phone right now and pledge your support for this kind of programming.