(00:00:00) Today's broadcast of midday made possible by the Twin Cities offices of Citibank citicorp providing Financial Services to the world since 1812. Good afternoon, Senator Rudy boschwitz. Thank you for coming in and visiting with us today. Yeah, thanks Bob. You're here in Minnesota. Probably attending the fair. Oh, yeah one time yeah. Oh, yeah. It's been the 8 10 hours a day out. There. These are all right. Oh, yeah meeting a lot of people and yep showing them all of your very you got some new milk products out there this year. I do indeed, you know, there's no question about the fact that the dairy industry are could do very well. If some of the merchandising that some of the Lord shall coops and producers in the industry were more imaginative, but the federal government does, you know buys all of the Surplus and there's not and they federal government buys it at the market price. So there's not enough incentive to really promote we have drinkable yogurt, which is new product and then we have our flavored milk. Then we have some Lactaid products. Some people can't digest milk because right and because of the lactose the natural sugars and milk and people miss an enzyme. So we have tablets that people can take so that they will get the enzymes of other products that will eliminate the lactase lactose in milk just to some imaginative approaches to the sale of a dairy products and in the hope that we will have some wider use of those things and that the dairy industry won't have to look to the government but rather to the consumer and that they both both sides will benefit. Well, you'll have an opportunity during the hour today to ask questions of Senator boschwitz about Farm matters, if that be of interest to you use a member of the Senate agriculture committee is also on the budget committee and on the Foreign Relations Committee among others one of the things I'd like to ask you about Senator Buffet before yeah. Sure. Restored may I may I say that I've been working on a grand Fir and pure a Federal grant comes through the national telecommunications and Information Administration is a technical name. And today we were informed that we got that Grant MP off of wanted it for Prairie Home Companion. They wanted more than they got but we gave them a hundred and eight thousand dollars, which is a very substantial amount of money and it's a matching Grant so that have to raise a few dollars to get it there, which is also okay and it'll allow Prairie Home Companion, which is now a broadcast on 248 stations to have new equipment. So it'll be broadcast from around the country is a live show and that'll probably put some traveling shoes on Garrison Keillor. Oh, yeah, and I think it's a grant that you people here at mpo approach this upon and Garrison Keillor was down in Washington lobbying for it. And I also Talk to them on a number of occasions and pleased to tell you you got the Grant and not quite as much as you wanted but a substantial amount nevertheless one seldom gets all of what one wants. That's true. Anyway, thank you sir. Sure that we will all appreciate your efforts on that. You know, there are some people that have been listening to this program for a long time and they have the telephone number memorized. Yeah, it's memorize. I'll tell you I'll tell the rest of you what it is though so that you can call in with a question for Senator Bosch, which this noon a Minneapolis. And st. Paul. The number is two two seven six thousand 2276 thousand in Minneapolis st. Paul in other parts of Minnesota. Our toll-free number is 1-800-695-1418. There's so many people already waiting. Let's just go right to the caller's and see what's on Pokemon as soon as you said the number two more calls came on. Yeah, right. All right. Your first go ahead you're on the air was Senator boschwitz. (00:03:58) Thank you down here in southern Minnesota and my people kind of represent the Gambit of political views from Groundswell the Farm Bureau. Um, one thing that I've been hearing is an awful lot of stress with PCA in the Farm Credit system with the drop in land values many operations are becoming risks PCA and it seems that they don't fit into their book of policies or something and the pharmacy to have lost control of the policies in the aren't sticking with them and I'm if I'm fiorina a domino effect, I guess I just like to express that concern to you and hear what you have to say about it. Also, maybe encourage some pressure on the web is in charge of this so that they stick with our operators that are good operator. (00:04:52) Well, we the Farm Credit Administration is fairly independent pastor, and we however probably going to get involved with it and we may indeed make some changes with respect to administration of the Farm Credit Administration. I think they're going to need Federal help. To keep afloat, and that includes the pcas, you know, you talk about the PCA book of policies. They they really change with the times not the many moons ago the PCA and the FMH a and and others were out there telling the former's that the smart former gets highly leveraged. They were telling them that they shouldn't build a bond for 30 or 40 cows but for sixty or eighty or a hundred cows and that they would be able to borrow because there was inflation in the air and values were increasing and they could borrow against those increased values and that good businessman leveraged in that way. Well now they have an entirely different tune and their book of policies and I'm pure is not very clear cut and they sing the tune that the bankers and to that that is a prevalent at the moment. Now, they're talking about cash flow no longer talking about increasing values and as you indicated the values Decreasing but we have a greater awareness of the problems of Rural America. I believe we do a matter of Fat Bob noted a little earlier. I'm at the state fair and spend eight 10 hours a day out there at my booth and I don't deserve the milk as much as I listened and talked to all comers and there's no question that many many farmers are coming up to me and describing the problems of the rural economy. I think I have a good sense of it. I've held hundreds of four meetings in rural Minnesota and we're not going to let the Farm Credit Administration go down the tubes and we're going to provide income support for the farmers as well. No matter how the farm bill looks it will have a generous income supports and I think it needs to and taxpayers who say well they shouldn't be that much your money your subsidy for for Mirza if we just let him go down to two but they're going to be so such massive failures that we bank failures and others and the same tax. Those who say don't give subsidies to the farmers are going to be bailing out the banks and that'll probably be more expensive move on to another listener with a question. Good afternoon. You're on the air. (00:07:21) Hi, I was wondering now is the senator since he favors military pressure on the sandanista government in Nicaragua. Does he also favored that we should maybe support military pressure on the government of Peter Botha in South Africa and if I could stay on the line because I don't have a radio with me. I'd like to just to hear the answer (00:07:43) so I would not support the ladder. All right, the that South Africa course has been in the news a great deal over the past several weeks. And I know that before Congress recessed the house passed a bill that would impose sanctions of some sort on South Africa the Senate didn't quite get to that parent lie, you'll get to it fairly early on when you reconvene. How do you plan to vote on that bill? What you know the sanctions and the so-called disinvestment frankly, I disagree with that and I think that it would be self-defeating to do that. You know, we in Minnesota have some experience with these economic boycott boycott to embargoes. They simply don't work. Maybe we'd be on the moral High ground and and that would make us feel better. But as I understand it the majority of blacks and the union of South Africa also don't favor The Disappearance of the American presence that we employ American companies who abide by the Sullivan principles, which are principles that give blacks that equal opportunities and there's 70,000 of those blacks working in South African probably among the best off down there and there's no reason to undermine that and very frankly if these economic boycotts are embargoes have not worked the Japanese would step in in a minute. I mean we wouldn't be penalizing South Africa the Swiss would do all the banking that they want to do and South Africa despite all of its problems. If we were to to in some way embargo it by rights. We should embargo and and impose trade sanctions on on lots of countries in the world and it's just self-defeating. I opposed a trade sanctions when they were imposed upon Nicaragua for the same reason. All right, 10 minutes past noon more listeners waiting and Senator boschwitz is listening. Go ahead. You're on the (00:09:43) air. Yes. Enter on that last question. I'd like to go a little further and ask what would your response be if during World War II the United or prior to World War II the United States were importing German gold coins minted and mind and marketed by Hitler's Third Reich and we were also investing in companies that were helping to support. The Third Reich, what would be your position on a economic sanctions in that case and a second question, I guess and I'll hang up to listen your response. Can you explain to the listeners your rationale for supporting continued production of nerve gas by the United States government. Thank you. (00:10:28) Well, I certainly don't think that there's much analogy to Hitler's Germany and South Africa and what we fail to do at that time is to properly impose ourselves as the the free nations of the world at that time felt that they could bargain with tyranny and that you know, they found out that they couldn't and we certainly should have armed ourselves and prevented them from going forward and some of their in some of their aggressive steps against their neighbors. That's certainly not the the situation in South Africa. There are there is no policy on the part of the South Africans to to eliminate or Annihilator a particular group. That doesn't mean that that apartheid is something that Any reasonable person could support I certainly don't and I'm sure that the listener understands that but the analogy between Germany and South Africa is hardly the case, you know think for a moment that about Bishop tutu. He is a Nobel Prize winner and you must understand that there is a is a very active and aggressive Free Press in South Africa that there's a very active and aggressive minority that as you may have noted in the papers yesterday or the day before is is organizing together with the Zulus at the inkatha conference, which is the conference of the Zulu nation. That is led by Chief buthelezi who also opposes the imposition of sanctions of disinvestment. But you know Bishop tutu is a responsible individual and he is given an opportunity to act and to certainly has free access to the press and so forth think for a moment on the other hand another Nobel Peace Prize winner. Mr. Sakura for Andrei sakharov for the Soviet Union. We don't even know where he is the Soviet Union denies in different ways of freedoms to its individuals have freedom of movement and other things some of which are also denied in in the union of South Africa. Should we discontinue their there is no minority a participation. There is there is no Open Press has no ability to even find mr. Sakura for much less allow him to operate as openly as we see the bishop in South Africa. Should we also embargo imposed economic sanctions? And thresher and let's say 50 60 other nations in the world that have as we pressive policy as South Africa does I think we should continue to express our outrage at apartheid. I think we should help the black majority and the union of South Africa exercise its its economic muscle and I think that that's what eventually will bring about some type of resolution of the problem is that the blacks will exercise their economic muscle and not much of South Africa MOVE with without the blacks trading at the white establishments. And in other ways supporting the white establishments. Those are the kind of things. I see beginning to happen and indeed I think that the whites will moderate their position when they when they are hurt in the pocketbook and and we really can't do that. If we disinvest if we do these other things, you know money is a The commodity the fungible commodity and and they're just all kinds of people around the world who would step in but we should help the X the blacks organized and exercise their rights. And I think that that's what will eventually bring accommodation in South Africa. I recall you're having made some comments on the nerve gas issue at the time the vote was taken but do you want to review your position very quickly under violence. Oh, I supported the production of new forms of a new format of chemical weapons as I called a nerve gas presently. They they are in shells that were the poison is already pre-mixed. The average age of those shells is somewhat in excess of 30 years. They are dangerous to handle their dangerous to transport simply in you know, they simply have to be replaced at leak and everything else the new one that that is Being built and remind you that for John Glenn and I introduced amendments on the bill which would allow the new production that for every new pound of this chemical that is produced two of the old pounds must be eliminated their they eliminated their burned in some way about half of the present chemical that we have is sitting in 55 gallon drums. And the other half is in the shells themselves the new shell that's being made would have two compartments and the the gases there would be inert until they are mixed and they wouldn't be mixed to learn flight and as a result, they would be a forum for better weapon and the weapon that we now have is is just plain outdated you, you know, it's a terrible weapon. All these weapons are terrible. But if you look at the Europe and there perhaps there's an analogy between The the Hitler's era and today if you look at Europe, you'll find that the Russians have 80,000 troops particularly as specifically trained in chemical warfare one out of four of the shells that they have in Russia in Europe that the Russians have all coming have chemical components to them the history of chemical warfare is you know, very clear and that is that of course during the first world war the Germans developed it and they used it and the finally during the course of the first world war was useless as both sides habit had it and both sides neutralize one another we entered into a protocol convention after the first world war that did not disallow production or didn't provide for any inspection. But this allowed the use of it. It was not used at all in the second world war and all government and Lucia government informed the Germans that if they used it first, then we would use it. We have a no first use policy. We continue to have no first use policy and if they used it, we would use it against the military installations that we had. A lot of it. The result was that it was not used at all during the second world war. There was indeed the turns it was used once by the Germans and the Germans are indeed contacted the allies and said it was by mistake. So there was no retribution, but when when both sides have it then when both sides are strong then there is a cause of 44 better probability of a that it will not be used. We do not have adequate weapons at the present time. I believe in deterrence. If you look at ports of the world where there is not the turns available in Afghanistan where the Russians have in hundreds of of documented interest incidents used a chemical weapons and in layoffs and in Bo deal with her again hundreds of documented instrument incidents of a communist use of these kind of weapons. That's the first real time that they have been used since the first world war and indeed we have to we simply have to be prepared. So I am in favor of this new and at least in the standpoint of handling and and shipment so forth safer weapon and you simply can't go on with the old one Senator really boschwitz in the Studio's today and we have a number of listeners with questions will take you next. Hello. (00:19:05) Hi, I would like to talk about this country helping itself particularly in regard to the gigantic budget deficit. Why you've been pushing for a freeze or reduction in the cost of living allowance on Social Security? if we were to do that step either freeze or reduce the cost of living allowance on Social Security and perhaps create a surplus in the Social Security trust fund the law mandates that that money that Surplus be invested in the United States government securities at whatever the current interest rate is. On the one hand, then the Surplus appears on The Ledger as a plus a saving on the other side of the Ledger. It appears as an equal that which the US government owes in fact more than that because it would have to pay interest on that debt. now people like you say that because the United States government. Would then not have to go out into the open Credit Market? and by and ask for funds on the open market to the extent that it would have the Social Security money invested in those funds that it would not raise the interest rate on credit instruments around the country and thereby save a lot of money. (00:20:51) I don't I don't I don't agree with all do you want to make your observational? Yeah. Well another let the gentleman complete but I don't he he seems to he seems to be stating that I that that he's expressing my viewpoint, which he is not but can you can you state the rest of your question rather succinctly sir? (00:21:10) Yeah. I would like to know just how you number one. You can place a specific value on how much money would be saved by the United States government not borrowing to the extent of that Surplus. And number two in the face of the fact that 21 billion dollars was slapped on the open market by the US government a couple of weeks ago and received one of the lowest interest rates ever showing that there is no credit crunch out there on the market. How in the world is it going to save a penny or is it all smoke and illusion as you said smoke and mirrors? All right, Senator, (00:21:55) well, it's not clear to me exactly what this gentleman is driving at. I look at the budget as a unified document that the in the event we make savings and Social Security that it that the budget is a whole is better off if we make savings and thereby have additional funds to invest in government securities that that that's just fine. I mean, there's going to be enough government securities around for the so Security fund to invest in for quite some time the Social Security funds are just part of the entire money market and really is an important. It is not important where the federal government borrows from the impact on the money market is the same. The real question is how much does the government have to borrow and the government has to borrow less if we don't spend quite as much and so that's that's the goal and the only way to control the budget is control all aspects of it and Social Security is 22% of the total budget. So if we say well that's off-limits. We're not going to touch that then a lots of other people will come in and say their programs are off limits and then we lose control of the budget. So I believe that we should control all aspects of the budget and the fact that the social security trust fund would thereby have more funds would mean that yes, they would buy more government securities, but then the banks are other To the of society would have to buy fewer such Securities and they would be able to invest to their money's in the private sector. All right, 24 minutes past not sure I got it exactly what that gentleman is driving at seems to be a rather a technical Point regarding how the Social Security funds would be invested. But anyway, we'll move on to another listener with a question. Go ahead please you're on the air. (00:23:51) There are about which my name is Gary Rainer. Hi Gary. I read today that President Reagan declared all segregation in South Africa's public areas had been eliminated. The statement was later amended by Larry speaks. I'd like you to comment if you would on how or why you think the American people let alone Republican party can or should continue to put public trust in the hands of a man who seems to demonstrate an incomplete grasp of both history and current events and all hang up in life. You're coming. (00:24:20) Well, I don't agree with the president. I don't agree with the president on this particular statement that he made and there's no question about the fact that the South African government has made some progress with respect to eliminating some of the aspects of apartheid. There's no question either about the fact that while segregation may have been eased. It's not been eased as we would understand or desire that to be the president the fact that I disagree with the president or that he looks at issues is somewhat differently than I you know, some instances doesn't mean that I abandoned him even my wife looks at issues a different differently than I do. I then she she has thankfully not abandon me and I have no intentions of doing that either. So I must say to the to the listener who's called in that I can. That his respect his confidence may not have been heightened by this statement and I understand that but I would I would hasten to add that that don't don't abandon the president entirely. I think that the overall he sound and I agree with most of his policies and as a result, you know, I support him Senator if the United States does not use the Stick of economic sanctions to encourage further progress in South Africa what sort of other sticks might there be or what carrots might there be please explain to me. What kind of a sticky economic sanctions is Well, obviously you don't think it is a stick and it's never been a stairs. Now how would it how would be a stick? Well, the supporters of it believe that it would would hurt the South African economy and thus would make it good when you hurt an economy. Whoo-hoo normally suffers when Anna let's presume for a moment that the supporters of the vesture of sanctions or whatever all correct when you hurt an economy, who do you hurt the most very obviously it's the people who are the poorest or the elderly or the young who is seeking employment for the first time and I tell you that's a very cruel blow to impose on a country that that is very poor to start with by comparison to ourselves and I hope that somebody will call and give instances of where such economic sanctions have worked. I might say that the people who call I would die. If any of them would be in the rural part of the state because if they have a something of a memory, they'll be called that economic sanctions imposed and call them ball goes against the Russians was still suffering from the question Still Remains a what can the United States do to encourage further progress in South Africa where they're very little we can do. Well, you know, we we have indeed going after the South Africans. Mr. Follin was over a speaking to their foreign minister. I believe they met in Paris a recently and stating very clearly the position of this government. We have withdrawn or Ambassador for consultations. We have expressed our displeasure in a number of ways. We did try when the mrs. Mandela her home was firebombed and also the Children's Hospital next to it. We did try to provide. It's a money's she didn't accept those money. She did accept money from 1200 United States senators to restore her home. I was one of those 12 United States senators who contributed to that effort. We you know, we're not going to send troops to South Africa and we we will have to continue to urge them and very frankly that the best thing that can be done. As I said earlier is to try to encourage the blacks to through people like Bishop tutu who is dedicated to a peaceful resolution of this and others to organize and exercise their economic muscle that probably is the most constructive way to go. It's about half past 12:00 noon more listeners waiting with questions and you're on the air was Senator (00:28:51) boschwitz. Oh, yes, my question concerns the elimination of state and local taxes. That is Reagan's that tax reform and I want to know where Senator brush with stands on that just a yes or no. Is he in favor? (00:29:05) I'm sorry that I can't answer. Yes or no. I have not taken a position on that frankly because I want to see how the entire treasury to package or the entire tax package develops in the event. We were to take out the deductibility of state taxes at this point. The whole thing would fall. I'm looking for substitutes and I have in mind some substitutes for the income that would be gained by the federal government by disallowing the deductibility of state and local taxes. But before I think that there are some very positive aspects of that tax package and before I say no to the whole tax package, which I would be doing if I said I will vote against such a disallowance of that deduction before I do that. I want to see how all the chips are going to fall and there's some time yet to go before those kind of decisions. Asians have to be made and there's some input yet to be made into that bill before we have, you know have to make a decision frankly. I want to remain a little bit aloof because if I'm going to have a impact on the final decision making process I'll be able to do so more if my boat is not already counted and if my vote is somewhat in doubt. Alright 29 minutes before one o'clock and your next go ahead (00:30:32) please. Thank you very much. Good afternoon Senator, I would like to ask you a question that I haven't heard addressed in a long time the country of Brazil. I think any of us would admit is not nearly as scientifically Advanced as we are are many other countries and yet their Automobiles and trucks throughout the country run on ethanol. I can't understand why a greater effort isn't being made in this country to country that can put men in space and on the moon and etcetera to complete this this task and have automobiles here running on this fuel which would make us independent and would help our environment and wouldn't you agree be an enormous help to the former's in our (00:31:16) state? It is the most constructive form a suggestion that exist. We would I'm not sure that we could run all of our vehicles on ethanol simply because I'm not sure we could produce enough ethanol, but probably the answer to your question of why the Brazilians do it and why we don't is that they have a large external debt. They don't have any oil themselves. They don't have a very strong economy. If you know if you're familiar with OPEC, you know that they require payment for their product in dollars and that they can't use the local Brazilian currency you have to Change that Brazilian currency into dollars and then pay the OPEC nations in dollars. The Brazilian simply don't have those dollars. So they are they you know need is the mother of invention or whatever that saying is that they have felt the hot breath of Economics little more than we do. I absolutely agree with you and I'm a very firm and an aggressive supporter of the idea of replacing lead for instance with ethanol somebody who I taught to out at the State Fair objected to that Viewpoint and said it would be very hard on on engines and pistons and Co-operators and I must say I don't know enough about it to to know that the use of ethanol as opposed to lead will will be hard on engines. I'm going to have to find out about that. I would support in the Corn Growers are many of them also support the idea of so much a bushel 123 cents a bushel used to either develop a Loan Fund the guarantee. Fund the research into ethanol and I agree that it is a very sound program and that we have to find ways of doing more another listener has been waiting for a while. And now you're on with your question. Go ahead (00:33:11) please. Yes. Hi. I'm getting back to the sanctions legislation. Again. My question is it does seem that the president and the Congress are on a collision course over this issue. I was wondering if you could tell me what you're feeling is do you think that the Congress will in the end override him on this? Thank you. (00:33:31) I depends how the bill comes out. The bill has not yet passed in the Senate the conference report. So it's hard to tell whether or not we're going to be able to pass the conference report. It may be filibustered and then you have a number of opportunities to delay the the Spill at later stages again. It's not clear to me what's going to happen and it's not clear to me what the other elements are before the Senate we will have a series of Appropriations bills that fund the various forms of government that will want that we want to pass we may have the tax bill will have a farm bill will have a number of other very significant pieces of legislation and that will to some degree determine whether or not the the African South African bill is considered or whether or not a filibuster will be successful if we have a 30 or 40 day period without too much other business before us we can break any filibuster. But if we also have to get all the other legislation passed the makers are the proponents of the filibuster will know that then we'll be able probably to defeat legislation. So it depends upon the business before The Senate whether or not we will be able to take up consider and pass that legislation. All right, 25 minutes before one o'clock. Senator Rudy boschwitz is in the Studio's. The telephone lines are busy. But I'll tell you the telephone number. Anyway, just in case you get lucky and get through its 2276 thousand in Minneapolis and st. Paul and in other parts of the state one 865 29700. You might get the busy signal on the other hand. You might get lucky as you did. Go ahead, please you're on the air (00:35:24) and I just want Before I ask my farm question how delightful it is to hear somebody who could be has a very sensible attitude both towards the South African question and towards nerve gas and isn't it terribly discouraging every night to have all the national broadcast begin with six people were killed in South Africa and not one word about all of the people that are killed in all the communist countries in Africa Ethiopia being starved to death and we know the whole rigmarole that this gets to be a really serious thing I think for our country to Center. So in just one place that is not nearly as bad as the rest and the thing I would like to ask you about the farm question is along the lines of you're being Innovative. We know are getting kiwi fruit from Australia. I understand because some of the wheat farmers are were there decided that they should do something else instead of added to the glutton of Wheat and we're getting very reasonable price why I don't Our Farmers study our market and see it. For example, two things. We could use lots more raspberries and we're getting lots more fresh green peas. And if they were in an area where they can refrigerate properly and get it to the cities, they studied that market with that be help instead of adding to the glut. (00:36:45) Well, let me first comment on your very kind comments about the South Africa and nerve gas. I think I as I speak about those two issues. I'm sure that many listeners disagree with me. I you know, I must tell you I like to be as direct as possible about these issues and I don't beat around the bush very much. And so I for those who disagree with me, I respect their viewpoint, but I don't want him to say at the end of an hour listening on the radio. Well, what did he say and he just he beat around the bush. I try not to do that a friend of mine the decided a matter of fact them member husband of a member of my staff here in st. Paul decided they're going to grow asparagus and they're now a rather large Growers of asparagus are they have hundred of 200 acres and but that parently makes them fairly substantial in the asparagus business and I'm not clear why peas and other products look here. Food, I don't know exactly how to grow them. Maybe part of the answer to this Madam is the fact that there are no government programs for those those types of food. I might say that for most kinds of food if you sit down and eat lunch and you have a piece of meat or you have lettuce so you have vegetables and none of those things have government programs and not a fact most of what we what we eat does not I don't know exactly the answer to that and I'd have to talk to some of my friends who are agricultural economists over at the University of Minnesota. They really should be steering farmers in those directions. If those directions can be if those you know, if they have economic viability to him, but you're right, you know, we we certainly could grow somewhat can grow asparagus up these ports. I suppose you could grow a lot of other stuff and and I think that No, that's what Stockman always used to say. I think his form in the western Michigan when from soybeans and other things into grapes and so he took some of the view that this lady from Duluth did and there may be some sensibility to it. I will talk to some agricultural Economist and see whether or not these things can be grown and whether or not they should be grown in Minnesota somebody senator who wasn't able to get to a telephone during the our wondered if we pass this question along to you relating to the Mega Mall project out in Bloomington and the fact that the developers are asking for various types of Public Assistance to put that facility up the question to you is Is it wise for local and state officials to Grant dispensations to certain groups in order to attract or keep business? I think that generally the answer is yes and that those dispensations should be extended to the locals as well. You know that I don't think that we should put you know, you can't put the existing shopping centers though. This is most certainly much more than the shopping center. You can't put them at a disadvantage by by subsidizing somebody else but as a practical matter, you probably do have to do some of that to attract people that's a very interesting proposal and a very unique and a very imaginative proposal that these brothers are pursuing for Minneapolis. And I think it's well worth consideration and I think you just have to put a pencil to it and if the state's going to prosper and if you're not going to put too many other people at a walk disadvantage with respect to this new competitor who's entering the scene I Should be done in that case and I think that that other tax advantages they should be extended to a domestic to Minnesota industries of a similar type. You know, gosh if we losing some of our best people I was talking the other night about 3:00 a.m. I go to Hutchinson or I go up to Alexandria. I'll go to some other towns where there's a 3M Plant or there. Also some other companies that have expanded Minnesota 3M unfortunately has not Fingerhut I visited Fingerhut they almost their entire operation is here in Minnesota. There's so meaningful to these towns particularly saying Cloud yesterday. I visited with an apparel manufacturer who just opened the plant and Benson, which he hopes will employ 300 people those things are so meaningful and we sometimes discourage some of the locals and I don't think we should spend all the money on people coming in but, you know apply them to people who are already here. And I've already exhibited quite a loyalty to Minnesota. So yes, I think we should do what's necessary to compete effectively on the National Market get the interesting employers into the state. And yes, I think that those kind of advantages should be afforded to the locals as well. All right back to the telephones and more listener questions for Senator boschwitz. Hi, you're on the air. (00:42:02) Hello. I would like to know where you stand on handgun control the National Rifle Association contributed substantially to your campaign. And now you voted against the existing ban on Interstate handgun sales you voted against the surprise inspection of gun dealers records and against the 14 day waiting period to allow for criminal record checks. None of those things deter legitimate handgun buyer. (00:42:26) Well, you know, I have long felt that the the real deterrence in the case of handguns are other things are sentences. That a mandatory. I find a while. We will continue to allow states to impose whatever rules they want and you simply can't go out and buy a handgun in this state and we will respect those rules. We nevertheless feel that really the answer to handgun control is to make the sentences are very determined and the Very exact and that the people who use a weapon in the commission of a crime know that there will be a certain sentence without any right to parole and that if the take if they carry weapon in a crime and if they take their weapon out of their pocket and point it at somebody then there's a new set of but the term determined sentences. Those are the kind of things that I think will really have an impact on The control of the use of handguns in this country and the arguments with respect to handguns and whether or not we actually will be achieving anything by imposing strict controls and and there are some strict controls on the sale of handguns in interstate commerce and I have supported those because they're there is no ability to impose any type of check or any type of control but I think the ultimate control is the one I mentioned and not just trying to put some type of arbitrary rules that that are not easy to implement. Anyway, you have 15 minutes before one o'clock more listeners with questions how you're on the air. (00:44:24) Oh, I'd like to hear the views of the senator on one aspect of our policy and Central America almost 40 years ago in 1946. The international court of justice or World Court is it's often known was ratified by the US Senate. And signed by President Truman and in the 40 years since then through all the struggles and conflicts that have gone on in the world. Only three countries had ever walked out of the world court. That was being Albania Iceland and Iran under the Ayatollah Khomeini. That is until the Reagan Administration who walked out of the world Court in a case brought by Nicaragua because the CIA had mind their Harbors, I would like to know whether you would attempt to justify that kind of violation of international law. (00:45:09) Well, you know, I oppose the president on that particular incident and I would not have I don't know if you're correct in your historical reference. I understood that a number of countries will not Grant jurisdiction to the world Court. I really don't know how many of them have walked out as you say that's a strange mixer Iceland and Albania and and Iran, but I don't know if historically and I accept what you say. I've no don't know if it's right or wrong. I understand. However that number of countries have not submitted themselves to the world Court even though they have ratified. The existence of the world Court, I felt that the mining of the Harbor's was a matter that was not directed at the nicaraguans, but it was directed internationally at other countries and it involved third and fourth countries and other countries and so it was clearly in my judgment and ill-advised an illegitimate act and I think we had a vote on it and I so voted right more listeners are waiting will take you next good afternoon (00:46:29) economics in South Africa seems to miss two points. I'd like him to comment on it one is that at present? We are perceived as the best friend of the South African government President Reagan called the best friend, but two-thirds of the world being non-white seems to me it's very important that we no longer perceived be perceived as a white guy. Turning up like government which is supporting not the oppression of non-white people. I think that's an important point that I'd like Senator boscovich to comment (00:47:05) on what would you just suggest what we (00:47:07) do? I would suggest that we take a stand that shows very clearly economically and every other way that we do not support the oppression of non-white people with two-thirds of the world being not white second point that I think the senator push it puts himself in with his staff is it seems as if he would support It would be against an embargo of cotton during the Civil War because it would hurt the very people were trying to help the American slave. And I think that there probably are more important aspects to a man's existence. When his freedom is threatened and the economic level I'll hang up and listen to the (00:47:50) Senators come. Well let that I might say that's easy for you to say up there and Grand Portage that there are more things that are important to a man's existence and his economic him and his family and they're down there without much. I'm not sure that they would agree with you and my understanding that the many of them don't I really don't see the analogy of of the the blockade of the Southern States during the Civil War during a time of War that's entirely different. I don't see that analogy at all. I if we are perceived as their best friend the South Africans, you know, that's a misperception of my judgment that we certainly have made very very clear through all kinds of links that that We do not approve in any way of measure the business of apartheid. I'm sorry that President Reagan seems to have portrayed the rulers down there as being more moderate than at least I perceive them to be and that didn't help. But if I knew of any economic sanction that would improve the lot of the people of Union of South Africa if I knew of an economic sanction, that would just not unilaterally penalize our own people here and make the Affairs of those 70,000 South Africans working for American countries, you know, almost hopeless Then I then I would then I would Take a different view point but I you know, I like to be on the high moral ground and I think that we are I think that I am that nobody likes apartheid less Nia, you know, I and my people have suffered similar types of worst types of persecution and so I'm particularly sensitive to it but this situation it's hard to analogize my judgment with a civil war with the Nazi era of 1930s and Germany's and 40s and Germany's. I don't think that they're analogous to that and I don't think we want to destroy the people were trying to help 9 minutes before one o'clock more listeners are waiting. Go ahead and you're (00:50:17) next. Yeah. I understand your She's all the support sanctions against South Africa on the basis that it would hurt only the little people given that as a basic understanding then why is it I don't see you out arguing against the sanctions against Nicaragua (00:50:34) and I did I objected to the sanctions Nicaragua objected to them when they when they came up in the Republican caucus and objected to the vice president who was at that caucus and I'm sorry if that was not publicly picked up but you know, I don't think that that's achieving very much either. Okay. Let's move on to another caller. Go ahead, please you're on the air. (00:51:01) Hi, I'm Victor and about the deficit and I think that one way to put a lid on spending might be in the area the military now the Boys At The Pentagon have done a great job. They can initiate the final solution of the Russian problem in 9 minutes and sustain I kill rate of about Two and a half million people per minute and I'll just for pennies per kill which is a dramatic improvement over previous employed methods of genocide. My question is what's good enough. Ideally, we kill them all instantly, but I know I have to settle for less than that. I'd like your opinion of what's an adequate kill rate. How many nuclear weapons are necessary? (00:51:42) Well that that is not quite sure how to answer that. The question is about the budget the caller should know that you know a budget considerations of this year. We're not we didn't give the Department of Defense of pennies increase that they're not going to spend more in 1986 and they did in 1985. So that that we agree that the budget has to be balanced and that all elements of the budget have to be affected. I have voted, you know for the development of new types of weapons. Indeed and suppose that the caller objects to that and I believe that I said earlier in the program very strongly and deterrence. I think that we as a nation should have a certain amount of pride during the last 40 years or so during not in substantial part of that period we had a had a monopoly on nuclear weapons and we used our strength there while we could have gained hegemony over most nations in the world. We used instead our strength to keep the peace and that's what we intend to do with our strength is to keep the peace. We don't want to build more weapons than necessary. We want to engage in negotiations for a reduction of weapons. We want to build weapons that are more stabilizing if the caller would accept that phrase and I think I agree with him that there are too many and indeed. It's my hope that it's my hope and smile. Reputation that within a reasonable period of time we will be able to negotiate lower levels of weapons. We are trying to do so we are trying to do so very assiduously very frankly. I think that the overriding element then preventing that from happening is interestingly enough fat. Mr. Gorbachev has to solidify his position in Russia. No Russian ruler has ever been able to do so in less than a couple of years and and there are too many pushes and pulls and that Society for us probably to conclude youthful negotiations very shortly so that it's my opinion that we will continue to be frustrated in our dealings with the Russians for some time and until such time as mr. Gorbachev feels very secure and until his new foreign minister who really has little knowledge of all this also feels very secure and their positions, but I am an optimist about The reduction of those type of weapons and I am also an optimistic that those kind of weapons will very well become obsolete in the next 20 years. We have less than five minutes left. Let's see if we can get a couple more listeners in with your questions. Go ahead please you're on the (00:54:36) air. I am calling a from South Minneapolis. I read in the paper yesterday that the chairman of the Metropolitan airports commission says that airplane noise is a federal responsibility. So I'd like to know what the Senators doing about excessive airplane noise from the Twin Cities International. I'll hang up and (00:54:54) listen. Well, I must admit to you that I have not done very much about that. And that issue has come very much to the for during this month when I'm back here in Minnesota, and I'm not not that happens. I'm not on those committees, but that you know, that's not an excuse. I wouldn't normally become involved in initiating legislation with respect to that but The I will indeed go back and if you call up afterwards, I'll take your name and and try to get back to you after we go back into session must tell you that I have been become very graphically aware of that issue most recently and I understand that the responsibility for the federal government lays in the fact that due to the deregulation. There are very many more flights. It was my understanding that certain noise abatement equipment had to be attached to airplanes. Apparently, I'm mistaken because I certainly know from friends that it's noisy one friend even told me that when he mows the lawn when a plane goes over sometimes you can't hear the lawn mower. Oh good Heavens. That's noisy its noisy. And so I must say to the caller that I thus far. I have not been involved in legislation on that issue and the issue really has come to the fore during my this August recess that I've been in Minnesota and I will get involved when I go back and if he calls I'll take his name and let him let him know what I'm doing when I do it. Alright another caller as we get near the end of the are go ahead please quickly. Hello. You're on the air. (00:56:30) All right, (00:56:31) Randy. Let's take another line there very quickly as quick as we can. Hi, you're on the air. (00:56:35) Thank you. I'm calling about them Senator during Burgers hose border commission and I would like to know how Senator boschwitz field above Fields about the creation of this commission. And also about his stand on acid rain. I'll hang up so I can (00:56:52) listen what you know, I must tell you that I follow Senator during Burgers lead in many of these items and I believe that that commission would indeed be a good idea. We've had a number of problems along the border is another matter. I am trying very hard to prevent the regional office of the Immigration and Naturalization Service being moved from Minneapolis to I think, it's Dallas. Want to go and we would become part of the region that's based in Dallas. In which case that the Border incidents along the Canadian border would seem like small potatoes to the problems that they have a down south. And so we have to keep the regional office up here and they want to readjust all the regions. I also support the Senate during Burgers position with respect to acid rain and we also trying to get other countries because you know, that's not even a state or a regional issue. It's an international issue and in order to effectively legislate on that. We not only have to do it ourselves, but get the Canadians and get other countries of the world to also take an active interest in that otherwise, we will not be able to act as completely if we need to. Well sir. The telephone lines are still full jammed full with questions for you, but unfortunately we have run out of time. So we're not going to be able to get to any more of our listeners today. Thank you for coming in and visiting with us today. And I suspect that if people want to visit with you out of the Fairway, you will have an opportunity to have that I'll be out there very good Senator most mostly in the afternoons and I stayed till about 8:00 9:00 o'clock good man. Sometimes come in the morning, but I try to get my work done in the morning and then go out there in the afternoon. All right, Senator Rudy boschwitz visiting with us today on midday. Good afternoon. Gary eichten here inviting you to join us later this afternoon for MPR Journal this afternoon on our cover story old friends say goodbye to judge Lord and a review of the new Mega Mall plan MPR Journal 4:30 on rfm network 5:30 on ksjn am in the twin.